25-08-2025, 06:36 AM
OK, final conclusions.
"The sun. It's rising again."
The bad
MGS4 has over nine hours of cutscenes which is an incredible achievement. There's a lot of wasted time within those 9 hours. Talking about how nanomachines were effectively the root and cause of everything, Drebin giving us over-dramatised backstory to a boss unit that was never given any actual time for anyone to feel anything about, mission briefings that seem to go on forever. Coming to an end-point for the series was inevitably going to result in more time dedicated to closing things out, but throughout the game there feels like an insistence on closing every possible loop and tieing up every single loose end, which feels more than unnecessary especially for a series that generally often loved to be vague and leave things open to interpretation.
Act 3. It sucks. Even trying to speedrun it is problematic as you're dependant on the moronic resistance NPC's movement to complete it, and the smallest thing can delay or impede his progress. It is such a painful section to play through.
Mei Ling is in the middle of leading the meeting discussing how to take on Outer Haven, and - rather unsurprisingly - Kojima contrives a way to get her to get down on all fours and give us multiple close-ups of her ass, even throwing in Johnny doing his best to grab it as she walks by. Quiet in MGSV is obviously utterly ridiculous from a design standpoint, but I actually think MGS4's collective female cast is the height of Kojima's absolute worst tendencies with the way he writes and uses female characters. The B&B Unit's designs and the weird fluid that drips all over them along with their overly sexualised approaches towards Snake; Naomi and Big Mama's breasts being on display in almost every scene; the player having the option to get Snake to not only stare at Naomi's legs but also try look up her skirt; Johnny trying to grope Mei Ling. That's all without even mentioning the Playboy tie-in, calling Rose to jiggle her boobs with the DS3 or looking at Akina Minami posters to improve Snake's psyche and stress levels, or the fact that the B&B Unit actors were nude when their scenes were recorded, but eventually weren't used in that manner in-game. If there's one thing I've never missed from MGS4, it is the way it treats all of its female characters, perhaps excluding Meryl (and even she is reduced to falling in love with Johnny what feels like minutes after he reveals himself to be a handsome buffoon).
The good
I thought I'd find trudging through this game again would be quite a laborious task. But I was genuinely surprised and honestly feel that this is a fun game. There are absolutely some irritating and unfun sections (once again looking at you Act 3), but I honestly had a blast playing it again and am actually looking forward to returning to it down the line. Once you're not taking in the entirety of the 9 hours of cutscenes on top of it, there's a lot of enjoyment to be had here. I've gone from overlooking MGS4's boss battles to feeling that this game has the most enjoyable set of boss fights in the series.
Watching Snake suffer throughout the final two acts in particular is a sorry sight to see and feels much more harrowing than I remember, but it packs the punch it aims for. I can't quite remember any other game with an elderly, dying character as the protagonist and it was a unique and brave creative decision to go with. Judging by his later performance in Peace Walker, David Hayter clearly did a number on his voice portraying a version of Snake in this condition, but I think it is perhaps the biggest example of his dedication to Snake and how much he has given to the series. Throughout, he completely sells Snake's devil-may-care attitude as he plunges himself towards the endpoint of his life, and he is absolutely superb.
"Snake... had a hard life." One of the most endearing facets of MGS4 is Otacon and Snake's friendship. They have both clearly struggled to connect (and stay connected) with other people over the years, but their friendship since they met at Shadow Moses has been everlasting. Otacon's and Snake's stewardship of Sunny had the potential to be as goofy and silly as, well, a lot of other things in MGS. But in the end it feels quite sweet. Otacon keeps her very sheltered (for his and her protection) but comes to realise at the end that it's no real life for her, and that with The Patriots gone, much like Snake tells Raiden at the end of Metal Gear Solid 2, perhaps it's time for them to "start living".
Part of that, though, is also down to his acceptance that Snake won't be around for much longer. He has to learn to let him go, alongside everything else that has made him feel safe over the years, perhaps in turn so he can learn to become a father for Sunny and can pass on what he has learned "to the next generation".
There's an impressive sense of finality with this game, perhaps undone to a degree by the epilogue and the nonsense from Act 4 onwards, but overall the sense of an impending end of an era was clear. There's a sense of irony in the fact that, given the manner that the series has progressed (or regressed) since it released, Metal Gear Solid 4 feels more like the point of finality that it was intended to be for the series now than when it released in 2008.
Thank you to anyone that went to the effort of reading this. I may edit the first post down the line just to put it all together so apologies that it is a bit messy, although I guess I made this thread initially to help put my own feelings and thoughts on the game together so maybe it's best as is. Perhaps after Delta I'll tackle Ground Zeroes again.
"The sun. It's rising again."
The bad
MGS4 has over nine hours of cutscenes which is an incredible achievement. There's a lot of wasted time within those 9 hours. Talking about how nanomachines were effectively the root and cause of everything, Drebin giving us over-dramatised backstory to a boss unit that was never given any actual time for anyone to feel anything about, mission briefings that seem to go on forever. Coming to an end-point for the series was inevitably going to result in more time dedicated to closing things out, but throughout the game there feels like an insistence on closing every possible loop and tieing up every single loose end, which feels more than unnecessary especially for a series that generally often loved to be vague and leave things open to interpretation.
Act 3. It sucks. Even trying to speedrun it is problematic as you're dependant on the moronic resistance NPC's movement to complete it, and the smallest thing can delay or impede his progress. It is such a painful section to play through.
Mei Ling is in the middle of leading the meeting discussing how to take on Outer Haven, and - rather unsurprisingly - Kojima contrives a way to get her to get down on all fours and give us multiple close-ups of her ass, even throwing in Johnny doing his best to grab it as she walks by. Quiet in MGSV is obviously utterly ridiculous from a design standpoint, but I actually think MGS4's collective female cast is the height of Kojima's absolute worst tendencies with the way he writes and uses female characters. The B&B Unit's designs and the weird fluid that drips all over them along with their overly sexualised approaches towards Snake; Naomi and Big Mama's breasts being on display in almost every scene; the player having the option to get Snake to not only stare at Naomi's legs but also try look up her skirt; Johnny trying to grope Mei Ling. That's all without even mentioning the Playboy tie-in, calling Rose to jiggle her boobs with the DS3 or looking at Akina Minami posters to improve Snake's psyche and stress levels, or the fact that the B&B Unit actors were nude when their scenes were recorded, but eventually weren't used in that manner in-game. If there's one thing I've never missed from MGS4, it is the way it treats all of its female characters, perhaps excluding Meryl (and even she is reduced to falling in love with Johnny what feels like minutes after he reveals himself to be a handsome buffoon).
The good
I thought I'd find trudging through this game again would be quite a laborious task. But I was genuinely surprised and honestly feel that this is a fun game. There are absolutely some irritating and unfun sections (once again looking at you Act 3), but I honestly had a blast playing it again and am actually looking forward to returning to it down the line. Once you're not taking in the entirety of the 9 hours of cutscenes on top of it, there's a lot of enjoyment to be had here. I've gone from overlooking MGS4's boss battles to feeling that this game has the most enjoyable set of boss fights in the series.
Watching Snake suffer throughout the final two acts in particular is a sorry sight to see and feels much more harrowing than I remember, but it packs the punch it aims for. I can't quite remember any other game with an elderly, dying character as the protagonist and it was a unique and brave creative decision to go with. Judging by his later performance in Peace Walker, David Hayter clearly did a number on his voice portraying a version of Snake in this condition, but I think it is perhaps the biggest example of his dedication to Snake and how much he has given to the series. Throughout, he completely sells Snake's devil-may-care attitude as he plunges himself towards the endpoint of his life, and he is absolutely superb.
"Snake... had a hard life." One of the most endearing facets of MGS4 is Otacon and Snake's friendship. They have both clearly struggled to connect (and stay connected) with other people over the years, but their friendship since they met at Shadow Moses has been everlasting. Otacon's and Snake's stewardship of Sunny had the potential to be as goofy and silly as, well, a lot of other things in MGS. But in the end it feels quite sweet. Otacon keeps her very sheltered (for his and her protection) but comes to realise at the end that it's no real life for her, and that with The Patriots gone, much like Snake tells Raiden at the end of Metal Gear Solid 2, perhaps it's time for them to "start living".
Part of that, though, is also down to his acceptance that Snake won't be around for much longer. He has to learn to let him go, alongside everything else that has made him feel safe over the years, perhaps in turn so he can learn to become a father for Sunny and can pass on what he has learned "to the next generation".
There's an impressive sense of finality with this game, perhaps undone to a degree by the epilogue and the nonsense from Act 4 onwards, but overall the sense of an impending end of an era was clear. There's a sense of irony in the fact that, given the manner that the series has progressed (or regressed) since it released, Metal Gear Solid 4 feels more like the point of finality that it was intended to be for the series now than when it released in 2008.
Thank you to anyone that went to the effort of reading this. I may edit the first post down the line just to put it all together so apologies that it is a bit messy, although I guess I made this thread initially to help put my own feelings and thoughts on the game together so maybe it's best as is. Perhaps after Delta I'll tackle Ground Zeroes again.
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